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A special meeting of the Board of Aldermen was held Monday, November 26, 2018, at 7:00 p.m. in the
Aldermanic Chamber.

President Lori Wilshire presided; City Clerk Patricia D. Piecuch recorded.

Prayer was offered by City Clerk Patricia D. Piecuch; Alderman-at-Large Michael B. O’Brien, Sr., led in the
Pledge to the Flag.

The roll call was taken with 13 members of the Board of Aldermen present; Alderman Schmidt was recorded
absent.

Mayor James W. Donchess was also in attendance.
President Wilshire

In keeping with our tradition, | will turn the hearing over to Alderman Dowd, the Chairman of the Budget
Committee.

Alderman Dowd

This evening we are having a public hearing on a change to R-18-092 which is amending R-18-001 authorizing
the Mayor and the City Treasurer to issue bonds not to exceed the amount of $15,500,000.00 for the
Performing Arts Center located at 201 Main Street. | am going to be calling for testimony in favor and
testimony in opposition. Anyone that wants to give testimony in favor will come up to the microphone and give
us your name and address and present your comments. Then | will ask for people in opposition, and they can
come up and give their comments. Once again | will then ask for anyone that is speaking in favor and once
again | will ask for anybody in opposition.

After that | will call the Public Hearing closed and after a very short pause, we will go into the Budget Meeting
to consider this motion.

Mayor Donchess
Mr. Chair | think the Ordinance requires that we explain what we are proposing.
Alderman Dowd
Yes | will get to that. But before we have comments in favor or opposition, we have to explain exactly what the
ordinance is consisting of and here this evening is Mayor Jim Donchess and | think he wants to call up Mr.
Cummings and Mr. Fredette to come up and sit in the circle with us and tell us what this is all about.
PUBLIC HEARING
R-18-092
AMENDING R-18-001 “AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND CITY TREASURER TO
ISSUE BONDS NOT TO EXCEED THE AMOUNT OF FIFTEEN MILLION FIVE HUNDRED
THOUSAND DOLLARS ($15,500,000) FOR THE PERFORMING ARTS CENTER LOCATED
AT 201 MAIN STREET”

As provided for in NRO 5-28, Mayor James Donchess gave a brief explanation on Resolution
R-18-092 prior to hearing testimony from the public.

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 2

Mayor Donchess

Alright Mr. Chair, well thank you very much. | was going to take a minute to explain what we have
accomplished to date and where we are and then why it is that we need the Resolution that is proposed before
you.

First of all, the bond issue passed back in March of this year so that was about 8 months ago. For the first
couple of months we were working on acquiring the building and the building was acquired in either late April
or early May sometime around then.

The next thing that occurred is that we formed a Steering Committee by resolution and we appointed and
confirmed members of the Steering Committee to help us oversee the project. Members of the Steering
Committee include members of the Board of Aldermen, community members, downtown people and citizens
as well, of course you approved all of this. We engaged Betsy McNamara as a fund raising consultant; she
has worked previously for the Nashua Soup Kitchen, for the Capital Center for the Arts and other significant
fund raising efforts throughout New Hampshire.

Over the course of several months she developed a fund raising plan, a plan of action, she also interviewed a
number of potential donors and activists around the community. She has reported to you that she is very
optimistic about her fund raising goals and more recently has been talking with potential major donors who are
interested in donating to this project. She reported to you that the way a successful fund raising effort
proceeds is that you start with the large donors, the largest donors, maybe as much as $1 million dollars and
then proceed on out from that to the medium sized then smaller donors.

We also engaged a New Market Tax Credit Consultant because we said from the beginning that part of the
money that we could raise or obtain from outside the City from non-City sources were New Market Tax Credit.
We engaged Neil Cannon who has also reported, | believe, directly to you and has indicated that he is very
optimistic that we can obtain an allocation of New Market Tax Credits sufficient to bring in $4 million dollars in
cash; that would come from private sources to whom the tax credits would be sold. New Market Tax Credits
have been successfully used in many communities in New Hampshire to build publicly spirited projects in
Concord, in Keene, in Manchester and this project fits well within the criteria for the New Market Tax Credit
Program.

We put out an RFP for architects and about 11 or 12 architects from all over the East Coast submitted
proposals, the Steering Committee reviewed those proposals and decided to interview 6 architects. Those
architects were interviewed, they had some very exciting and interesting ideas; some changes to the concept
plan that was developed by Duncan Webb that could make the project a stronger one. We can discuss the
details of what they have suggested, but the final architect has not been decided upon or recommend to you
yet. The meeting is on December 3" to go through the discussion and to see who the Steering Committee will
recommend.

In addition we put an RFP for construction managers to manage the project; we got again around 10
proposals. We interviewed 4 construction managers and again those selections will be discussed at the
meeting on December 3” and we will recommend to you or the committee will recommend to you the
construction manager that the feel will be most successful with respect to this project.

We put an RFP regarding venue operators and we received a proposal from Spectacle Management, a very
qualified and experienced operator who could oversee the project who is extremely optimistic and believes that
contrary to what we might have thought, that this venue can be operated in a way that would require no
subsidy whatsoever and, in fact, might turn a slight profit. We know that other venues in New England do that
like the Palace; they operate on a break even basis every year. Other successful venues around New England
are in Concord, in Lexington, in Lowell, even in Londonderry and the operator is very optimistic that we can
equal or exceed those results and run a very successful Performing Arts Center here in Nashua.

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 3

We formed a Capital Campaign Committee which has been meeting regularly for a number of months. In
order to execute the Betsy McNamara plan, Deborah Novotny of the Enterprise Bank has agreed to be Chair of
the Committee. She is very active in the community, formally President of the Rotary Club and active in many
other ways in Nashua.

We are developing Articles of Incorporation and those are in draft but with everything else going on, they
haven't yet been finalized. So we have learned a lot about this through all of this investigation and all of this
work, we have learned a lot about what it will take to first construct and then operate a successful Performing
Arts Venue which will bring, we think at least 70,000 people a year to Main Street. The Palace brings 140,000
people to Manchester’s downtown every year; even if we achieve half of that, that is 70,000 people a year.

So there are two simple concepts that are incorporated in this resolution; let me step back a minute, we believe
and we are very optimistic that we can raise not $4 million but $6.5 million dollars consisting of New Market
Tax Credit and private donations. This is based upon the work of Betsy McNamara, the fund raising committee
and Neil Cannon the New Market Tax Credit Consultant. So we are looking at bringing in $6.5 million dollars.
But what we have learned is that if we want big donors and if we want to qualify for New Market Tax Credit, $4
million dollars, we need to have a designed project. So as the Resolution was passed the Resolution
authorized the purchase of the building of 201 Main Street but that was all before money was obtained. We
have now learned that in order to qualify for the New Market Tax Credit and really in order to get significant
donors to contribute, we need to have a design project.

As we have talked with the architects, we know that ultimately the design may be changed from the original
concept plan. For example, it may be that is much more advantageous to bring the center to the first floor and
have some retail along Pearl Street. It might even be advantageous to reverse the orientation of the
Performing Arts Center from one where the stage is on the east side or the Main Street side, switch the stage
down to the other side to the west side and then have the entrance come in from Main Street. As we ultimately
pick the architect, these are the kind of decisions that need to be made based upon what we have learned in
terms of operating a successful Performing Arts Center.

One idea that is incorporated in the Resolution is that it would allow us to spend the money to design the
project now, because it is a chicken and egg thing. We think we can get $6.5 million dollars, but to do that we
need to have a design project so that is number one.

Number two proposes that we still bring in at least $4 million dollars and | am saying our experts are telling us
that we can do a lot more than that. But that we create more flexibility as to how this money would be used, for
example — because we have the operator who is saying we can operate this as a profit it may make more
sense to devote money that we bring in to reducing the project cost. For example, the New Market Tax Credits
can be used to reduce the amount of the bond that we need to borrow. So maybe we would end up borrowing
not $15 million; $15.5 is authorized but maybe it would be $14.5 or maybe it would be $13.5. So the
Resolution as proposed still requires that we bring in at least $4 million dollars, but it allows us, later on, to
decide how we think that $4 or $5 and I’m saying $6.5 million dollars can best be allocated to the reduction of
the project cost or to the endowment or both.

So the two simple changes that are proposed here: 1) It would also us to design the Performing Arts Center
immediately and 2) it would authorize enough flexibility that down the road we could decide how we want to
use the $6.5 million dollars that our experts and consultants believe that we can obtain.

| don’t know if Tim Cummings, Economic Director has anything else to add.

Tim Cummings, Economic Development Director

No | believe you have covered everything Mr. Mayor.

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 4

Mayor Donchess

We are both available for questions if anybody has any at this time or later on or whatever you want to do.
Alderman Dowd
Does anybody on the Board have questions of the Mayor?

Alderwoman Melizzi-Golja

| do have questions but since this is the Public Hearing | will hold mine for the Committee Meeting, thank you.

Mayor Donchess

And | will be glad to stay around for that.
Alderman Jette

If it is appropriate to ask a question, how much money are you talking about to design; how much do you need
to design?

Mayor Donchess

We think it is about $1 million dollars, usually it is 10% of the project costs so we are projecting $1 million or a
little bit more. They are telling us $1 million dollars and we would sign a contract that would fix the price.
There is a little difference between the architects, but $1 million dollars is the ballpark.

Alderman Jette

Why aren’t you just asking for authorization to borrow $1 million dollars to design the project. Why are you
tying it up into the Resolution that was already passed that had this condition about the $4 million dollars
before you borrow any more money?

Mayor Donchess

Well because the Resolution has passed and we’ve discussed all this bond counsel; the Resolution that
passed says we can’t spend any more of the money that the Board of Aldermen authorized that money be
borrowed up to $15 million but said in the original resolution that only $2 million dollars could be spent period
until at least $4 million dollars is obtained. It turns out that in order to get $4 million or $6 million we have to
have a design project; so we have this chicken and egg issue. We can get $6.5 million dollars we think if we
have a design project, but we need to spend money now, now to design the project in order to obtain those
funds and right now as passed the Resolution doesn’t authorize the expenditure for any money for design.

Alderman Jette

But couldn’t you have a Resolution that was specifically aimed at the $1 million that you need for design and
not tie it into the current Resolution which requires the $4 million to be raised?

Mayor Donchess

We could only seek that change but it seemed like we were here when | discussed this with Brian before, it just
seems to us at least, pretty clear that we can bring in more than $4 million dollars, that is probably makes the

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 5

most sense to try to reduce the project cost and to just provide the flexibility to ... and again the Board of
Aldermen would need to approve some of this. We thought it would be best since we are here to try to create
the flexibility so that the Steering Committee and the Board of Aldermen of the City could decide how best to
allocate the $6.5 million dollars.

Testimony in Favor - None

Testimony in Opposition Good evening, my name is Karen Bell resident of Nashua, 95 Parnell Place
here in Nashua. So along with Alderman Jette’s comments which were very good, thank you, | have a few
questions myself. So we had to raise the $4 million dollars ok, if $1 million dollars is for design and there was
a stipulation by the Board of Aldermen that you couldn’t use more than $2 million dollars, well you are going to
have a $1 million dollars when you raise the $4. So you could raise that, you could use that. And if you are
confident that you are going to raise the $6.5 that’s fine, there’s no Resolution necessary because you only
had to raise $4 million dollars within 2 years, it being signed by you Mayor Donchess on February 20", 2018,
giving the deadline to be 2/2020 for that $4 million dollars to be raised.

So if we think that there is a lot more money out there in the community it would seem like raise the money and
spend the $1 million dollars, because it was for the design, correct? Part of that $4 million dollars could be for
the design. And | understand the chicken or the egg thing because a lot of non-profits and | have been part of
some in the City myself, if you want to build a new building or have a huge capital campaign, yes you need to
elicit a professional fund raiser, you need to have a design, all of these are expenses which occur well in
advance of knowing the actual cost of your project.

So to just throw out and say we need $4 million dollars before we can move forward and we have two years to
raise that, that’s all well and good but there should have been some knowledge, some forethought and some
very hard knowledge about what that needed to be to have a design, to have a professional fund raiser on
board, to know the tick marks of what is going to take to get to that number. Having been told by these
professional fund raisers that there is $6.5 million dollars in the community, that’s great whether it is from non-
City private enterprise or not.

Where are we at if | might ask toward the $4 million dollars, what is our bank account number toward the $4
million dollars at this point, who can answer that for me?

Mayor Donchess

| can. In answer to the first question why don’t we just take the $4 million dollars and use that to design, for
example with the New Market Tax Credits, we don’t even qualify, we can’t even submit an application without a
design. So without a design forget $4 million dollars.

Ms. Bell Well wait a minute forget the $4 million dollars, this is going to be a non-profit entity correct, the
Performing Arts Center?

Mayor Donchess

Yes.

Ms. Bell So the New Market Tax Credits are totally different than just someone say Alderman Caron making a
very generous donation of $1 million dollars out of her own pocket either way it is going to be a donation. So as
a non-profit entity, if somebody wants to make a donation it is a tax credit period versus a New Market Tax
Credit; which is fine that it is a New Market Tax Credit but as a non-profit Performing Arts Center every
donation will be a donation, a tax deductible donation. So what is the difference if we are raising money now as

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 6

an authorized non-profit, recognized in the State of New Hampshire versus waiting to get New Market Tax
Credits?

Mayor Donchess

You have to wait for me to finish the answer. Alright so we have a potential of raising from the sale of New
Market Tax Credits, but to even get to that point you have to have the design project. Number 2, the fund
raiser is telling us that we have the possibility and they are talking to some specific people who don’t wish to be
known yet, about giving half a million maybe even a million dollars for the naming rights. But they are not
going to do that without a design project. So to get the money we need to be able to show specifically what
this is going to look like.

| think you had a second question?

Ms. Bell Where are we at the $4 million dollars, what is in the bank right now?

Mayor Donchess

So what the fund raising consultant has advised that in every successful fund raising campaign that she has
worked on and if you think about say the Soup Kitchen or any of the others, in order to be successful you
should not start raising small dollar amounts. You go and you find your big donors first, you get them to
contribute and then you use that momentum to then to work to kind of medium-size, then to small donors. So
her advice has been and | think her record demonstrates she knows what she is talking about; do not go out
and try to get $100.00 donors at this point, get your committee together, solicit big donations, and get your big
donors at the beginning.

So following her advice we have not really tried to get $10.00 or $100.00, the first donation needs to be a half a
million or $1 million dollars.

Ms. Bell_| absolutely understand and | wasn’t thinking of the first round of donations having been through this
process before as an executive director in the non-profit sector in this City | know that the $10.00 and the
$20.00 donations are huge but they are a large number at the bottom of the tier. They are nowhere near the
top of the tier where you are looking at naming rights, half a million, $1 million, hundreds of thousands of
dollars or even the New Market Tax Credits, which will come from businesses to the tune of maybe $50,000.00
or something along those lines. But | think that when this was voted on by the residents of Nashua, | think
many who may be, well | don’t know what many people thought, but that there were some donors already lined
up because there was such confidence exuded by those for this project that you know, all we need is two years
to raise $4 million dollars. So either they were a pie in the sky you know dreaming in some room or they
actually had some forethought and had some discussions with people with money.

| understand naming rights, | understand large donations but people who want naming rights, they know where
the building sits. It is not like it a project in a field with nothing. It is not an empty field, it is an actual building, a
current building on Main Street so they know the location. They may not the design of every window and floor
and seat, but there must’ve been some discussion about a minimum number of seats to bring in certain acts
and how much tickets would be sold for so that there was a little bit more heft in the information for them to
think, “Ok | have money, | am a philanthropic individual who plans on spending whether it an anonymous
donation or not or naming rights” that they know where the building is. And that they know that there is going
to be extensive design work but there had to be some commitment somewhere along the way from engaged
donors and known philanthropists to have assumed that in two years, $4 million dollars could be raised,
regardless of the New Market Tax Credits, which is a whole another second step.

And | applaud you if you get that money, if you get another $2.5 million dollars from those tax credits, great.
But | think that if we are still on and another question | had was that if this Resolution goes through, does now

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 7

the 2-year clock start ticking today? And the clock is re-set versus February 20" of this year, or is still ticking
as of February 20t and you have a year and roughly four months to get that same amount of money? Just to
say that there will be tax credits involved after there is a design module submitted; so when does the clock
start?

Mayor Donchess

| think the clock would remain the same but the chances of bringing in the $4 million dollars from the New
Market Tax Credits alone that would happen in 2019. So within the two years and so | think we are fine with
the 2 years.

Ms. Bell So still 2/2020 is the deadline and | know you said you weren’t at the point of the $10.00 donors,
$50.00, $100.00 and all those.

Mayor Donchess

We want enthusiastic support which | think we have but the advice of the professionals that we have is that you
need to get the big donations first, because if you allow someone who is thinking about giving $1 million dollars
to give $1,000.00 and sort of walk away, you are leaving a lot of money on the table. So the idea is, and again
this has been done over and over again, to get the big donations first.

Ms. Bell_ And I’m not sure if you had answered the question, I’m sorry if you did and | missed it, what is in the
bank up against the $4 million, what is our balance.

Mayor Donchess
We haven't really sought donations.
Ms. Bell Do we have nothing?

Mayor Donchess

We have followed the advice of the fund raiser and have not sought donations until we get the early large
contributors.

Ms. Bell So the whole thing is changing so that some of this money can be used for design when it wasn’t

before and in 2019 there is an expectation from everyone around in this room that there is going to be a
windfall of $6.5 million dollars between private funding which will include New Market Tax Credits.

Mayor Donchess
Correct.
Ms. Bell So our window just got really smaller and the expectation just got much heftier.

Mayor Donchess

| just want to make it clear that these aren’t my ideas, these are the ideas that the Capital Campaign
Committee and the fund raiser and the experts have come up with. So | am telling you ... this isn’t sort of my
theory, it is the theory and the plan of action that people who are very experienced in these areas have
developed.

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 8

Ms. Bell Absolutely, | spoke to some of those same people when we were investigating the Capital Campaign
many years ago. But! don’t want to be disillusioned and think that we have a bank account somewhere in the
City that has money in it when there is not. Yet we as a City do currently pay for operating costs of the
building, although they may be minimal of heat and electricity and that we do not yet have any funds for this.
So | just wanted to understand that fully.

Mayor Donchess

There are actually 10 apartments in the building, 5 of which are rented, so we are bringing in more money
through those rents than we used to bring in through property taxes. So there are funds to support the
operation of the building as it currently exists.

Fred Teeboom My name is Fred Teeboom, | reside at 24 Cheyenne Drive. | should say that | also own a non-
profit and | raised about $150,000.00 of private money, it took 4 long years for the Holocaust Memorial. Let me
just summarize a little bit more succinctly what this Resolution is about. It allows the $15.5 million dollar bond
to be used for the design before $4 million dollars is raised from private funding. It also allows New Market Tax
Credits to count towards the $4 million private funding. It allows private funding to be used for anything other
than exclusively operating costs. Those are good things but let’s take a look at them.

The New Market Tax Credits are really not private funds, they are really redirected tax money. Somebody gets
a tax credit, say $100,000.00 and they don’t pay that in taxes they pay that in contribution, same as paying a
charitable contribution. So it’s really not private funding. Now these changes, |’m not against them, | think they
are good things to do. Why wait for the design until the $4 million is raised? You might as well spend $1
million trying to design this thing, because if you are going to do it, you have to design it. You already spent $2
million dollars buying the building and the land, not even knowing if you are going to raise the $4 million

So these are good things. The problem that | see is the referendum of last year. In the referendum of last
year, and | have a copy of it, it says exactly what is in this resolution before you, before it is marked off. No
one in the City when they voted on this, was told about these changes. And I'd like to know, Mr. Mayor, my first
question, on what basis are you making these changes? Shouldn’t’ you go back to the voters and get them to
vote on this?

Mayor Donchess

You could do, it would take years, but in my opinion the people that voted for the project and it was a majority
would believe and | think even some of the opponents, you have kind of suggested so yourself, that it would
make sense to if you need to design the project to gain the funds that are necessary to proceed, that you
design the project. | don’t think that people would’ve said it wasn’t understood that we would need a design
project at the time this was proposed. So | think if that had been understood and it had said we could spend
money for acquisition and design rather than just acquisition, | don’t think people would have voted differently.

Mr. Teeboom That was not my question, my question was can you do this? Have you checked with your legal
counsel to see that you can make a change to a Resolution that was voted by only 1.5% by the way.

Mayor Donchess

The answer is yes, we have gone over this in detail with bond counsel, they are the people who decide
whether bonds can be sold. David can give you the name of our bond firm and we were on the phone with
them last week and today.

Mr. Teeboom How about Attorney Bolton? The City Attorney not the bond attorney.

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 9

Mayor Donchess

The City Attorneys are fine.

Mr. Teeboom They said fine?

Mayor Donchess

Yes.

Mr. Teeboom Well | needed to ask you because | am convinced. | am not your legal counsel.

Mayor Donchess

The vote was only advisory | mean it wasn’t a binding vote. The vote went to the people it was kind of what do
you think?

Mr. Teeboom It says authorize, no, no, no. | have a copy of it right in front of me, it doesn’t say advisory, it
says authorizing the Mayor and the City to issue bonds. Authorizing the Mayor and the City to issue bonds not
to exceed the amount of $15,500,000.00, it is not advisory.

Mayor Donchess

The Board of Aldermen in a City are the only ones that can authorize a bond issue.

Mr. Teeboom Anyway let’s go on, I’ve raised this issue, I’d like your legal advisor.

Mayor Donchess

Now Mr. Teeboom, | appreciate your coming to all of the architectural interviews and you’ve shown great
interest in the project and | appreciate that.

Mr. Teeboom | don’t want to get stopped, it won’t be me, | already have a law suit against the City, that’s
already in the Supreme Court.

Mayor Donchess

We don’t need another one.

Mr. Teeboom Somebody else could, somebody else could stop it easily done. At least easily brought to
court. It does raise an issue that I’ve had a problem with this Board and the previous Board and maybe the
Board before that. That is you approve resolutions without really having done the due diligence of figuring out
the cost. If all the resolutions should get done after everything else is established, the final step. As an
example, when we did the Broad Street Parkway, debated for years, | sponsored the bond resolution for the
Broad Street Parkway, | personally did. | was the tenth vote, | took a lot of grief on it, but | did it only after we
have very detailed cost studies and options. In fact, | put the options in the bond resolution, option 1 and option
2, you may recall, very detailed. Now you say well we should have written it differently, we should have
thought through this whole charitable thing. It wasn’t thought through. And know that it happened through the
previous board when they voted it down, you didn’t get the 10 votes that you need, and Clemmons raised his
hand and said, “I want to for a referendum” and somebody else stuck in the $4 million, | think that was done on
the floor, on the floor, somebody says, “$4 million bucks”. They didn’t have any rational, no thought. Great
let’s vote that one. Now let’s put it before the voters, great let’s do that one. No thought at all, that is not how
you do bond resolutions.

Special Bd. of Aldermen — 11/26/2018 Page 10

| have reviewed, probably the only public person that did, not being a member of the Board or the Steering
Committee, | reviewed all 12 proposals for A&E services. | reviewed all 11 proposals for the construction
manager and | have reviewed the one and only proposal for the operating service Spectacle Management. |
attended, you saw me there, sitting on the side like a fly on the wall, six bidder interviews for A&E services, all
the six. Your three bidder interviews for construction manager all bidders are qualified in my opinion and I’ve
got construction experience, some obviously more than others. Now what interested me was the cost, the very
reason you are here, cost. That is what bonds are all about, cost. The $15.5 million dollars in case you’ve
forgotten is $2 million dollars for land purchase; there is $1 million dollars for design; there is $1 million dollars
for staging and audio visual equipment, after all it is a performance theatre, not just a building; and $11.5
million dollars for construction The memorandum written by Tim Cummings and presented by Duncan Webb.
| tried to dig into this $11.5 million. You know something, | never could find the rationale, | never could find a
spread sheet on it.

| did find, when | did the Right to Know Law request from Mr. Cummings through the City Clerk, | found that
Fennessy Consulting had been hired by Duncan Webb to do costing for this project, they were paid to do
costing for this project. Guess what they came up with in detailed spread sheets, for Main Street, also for
Court Street and for this new building on Spring Street, guess what they come up with for this project on Main
Street? $16.4 million dollars, $16.4. $16.4 million dollars, | can show you the spread sheets, in fact if you
want me to, Ill e-mail you the spread sheets, in fact | will e-mail you the spread sheets. What would happen
then, this was never made public, | got the sheets because | asked through the Right to Know Law.

Then what happened is that Alderman McCarthy who was very much involved, went to Harvey Construction,
Harvey does a lot of work for the City for the schools and asked Harvey Construction if they could look at
Fennessy’s estimates at no cost. Guess what Harvey come up with? $15 million dollars. When | asked them
and I’ve talked to Harvey, I’ve talked to the Vice President, | said “what is this based on”. He said “We made a
comparison from the Boston Market, Fennessy’s of Boston’s organization and the New Hampshire Labor
market and we figured we’d take a reduction, that’s how they came up with $15 million.

Then McCarthy went back to them and said “Il want you to descope, we don’t do much on the interior, we don’t
raise the roof, we use the mechanical, cut the cost down” and they came up with an estimate of $10.5 million. |
asked Bernier, what is the validity behind it? And he says, “Well it’s really not very valid because you are
asked to do things that couldn’t possibly build a theatre with’. So what you are left with is a $16.4 million dollar
estimate to do the job and a $15 million dollar to do that job. Certainly not this magical $11.5 million dollars
that Tim Cummings come up with that he never backed up. |’ll stop in a minute and ask Mr. Cummings if
you’ve ever backed it up with a spread sheet.

Mr. Cummings

| would. | don’t know if makes sense for me to comment now or wait until Mr. Teeboom is done with all his
comments in its totality so | can respond to them.

Mr. Teeboom Ok that’s acceptable. Now the original design, well the final design by Duncan Webb in
summary for this Performance Theatre, is 550 tiered seating, like Cinemagic tiered seating, 550 tiered seating,
500 table seatings, tables on a flat surface, you have to be able to bring the staging down to a flat surface and
a thousand standing. People today they wave and they stand you know I’ve seen it, waving, stomping, in
unison, thousand. That was a design and the second floor up, the second floor up because the downtown
merchants who paid for these studies of Duncan Webb through parking meter fees called Downtown
improvement funds, insisted on having retail space on the bottom floor. That is the design currently, lots of
proposals there is no other design right now on the table.

So | should also mention that in the list that Fennessy prepared in the detailed spread sheet here are some
exclusions, quite a few exclusions in fact, one of them is no hazardous material. And we found out through the