Search

Board of Aldermen Page 29
September 27, 2016

Alderman Cookson
Well that’s implying isn’t it?

Alderman Siegel

Come on, point of order. That’s almost a violation of the code of conduct.

President McCarthy

Alderman Clemons, please refrain from remarks of that type.
Alderman Clemons

Why, because | stated...

President McCarthy

Because it implies...
Alderman Clemons
No, | didn’t imply anything.

President McCarthy

It implies that this Board is the reason why it was done by proclamation and if you want to say that then
say it and explain why but don’t leave things to inference.

Alderman Moriarty

So adhering to the code of conduct | am not going to infer or guess what people’s vote are but | would
like everybody in the room to ask yourself what has motivated you to come here, what is it really that you
want, that you are trying to express? Are you trying to express that we are a Welcoming City. When |
take time out of my day to go and visit the Ethnic Awareness Committee and do an investigation, there is
a reason why | am doing that. | am in support of the idea of Nashua being a Welcoming City and there is
a reason | want to do that. | like “Live Free or Die” in New Hampshire. | like the fact that we are a free
state. | support liberty and | support people who come together and create an alliance. | like how we are
a Welcoming City and | think all of this makes America great but | am not, as an elected official, going to
get on board with endorsing the political organizations that call themselves those things that | just called.
So my motivation to support this piece of legislation as it came out of the committee | think is the exact
same motivation as to why you are all here and is why we would get a unanimous vote. |’m telling you
now that my motivation for why | am not going to vote for this is because it supports an organization that
is unnecessary to be attached to this document which | have issues with.

Alderman Dowd

Two points, one is that | haven’t heard anyone say that any city or organization has had any negative
action because of being part of this Welcoming City. I’ve heard tax things but that can be said for a
number of organizations. Are there any organizations that have any negative implications from being
part of this initiative? Number two, whether this went back to the committee 16 times, | don’t see
anyone’s opinion changing and if it came back to the full Board then | still don’t see anybody’s opinion
changing so | still think we should take a vote and if it passes it passes and if doesn’t it doesn't.

Board of Aldermen Page 30
September 27, 2016

Alderman O’Brien

With regret, Mr. President, my esteemed colleague did bring up the example of Manchester after | read
off a number of communities and if | can through the chair, just to clarify, wnat was the final outcome of
Manchester on this? Is it approved in Manchester?

President McCarthy

My understanding is that it is.

Alderman Siegel

So, here we are, we are going to waltz around and vote on this and maybe it will pass 8 to 7, again,
Alderman McCarthy has been rather insightful but if you care about the optics does that make sense.
That’s probably a bad message so congratulations, you'll pass something and that’s no good. But, that’s
what is going to happen because | think, again, | really want to pass something that says Nashua is fine;
| don’t want to have a problem but we had a good compromise, something that would send a much
stronger message and that’s not going to happen with this glued in there and that was clear in committee
so if you wanted to say the same types of arguments then yes that’s true but the only outcome would be
what is spit out of committee; either what has already been spit out of committee or the thing that is
before us now. So you are either going to have an 8 to 7 vote on something and what’s the message
there? | mean really? Just vote it down and then you have the opportunity of voting on the original
legislation or the legislation as amended. You can get two more cracks at it. This seems silly.

Alderman Cookson

| wanted to refer back to the Ward 2 Alderman’s question about how it is affecting other communities and
what the impact is. | think that is the exact type of question that that we should have discussed in the
committee.

Alderman Deane

This is a perfect example of how not to do something. | find this whole situation rather embarrassing for
the city and the Mayor. | was at the committee meeting and correct me if | am wrong but | thought that
amendment left the committee with a 5 to 0 vote with Alderman Clemons stating that he was going to
vote for it but if someone called him up he was going to listen to what people had to say, which | think we
all do. | came tonight looking to hear some debate but also to vote on the amended version that we sent
out of committee that we discussed for about an hour. That’s what the five of us agreed upon. Here we
are looking at this WelcomingAmerica.org and whatever the spin may be, | mean, | went on their website
and | clicked on their little learn button and then | went to their welcoming strategy and then | clicked on
the full strategy and | read through it. | guess everybody is entitled to their own opinions but it just seems
like we are signing on to a heavy lobbying effort for the federal government. That’s what it looks like to
me. That’s just my opinion. | look at this goldenrod copy that | would support. | think we all should
support it, it’s time to save a little face.

Mr. President, the motion on the floor is to re-refer? That was shot down, right?
President McCarthy

Correct.
Alderman Deane

So now the motion on the floor is for final passage of the amendment that was made by Mayor
Donchess?

Board of Aldermen Page 31
September 27, 2016

President McCarthy

It’s to amend.

Alderman Deane

Would my motion to vote on the goldenrod copy be out of order, Mr. President?

President McCarthy

| believe you can actually motion to amend the amendment to the goldenrod copy.

MOTION BY ALDERMAN DEANE TO AMEND THE AMENDMENT TO THE GOLDONROD COPY

Alderman Lopez

Can | make a motion to amend the goldenrod copy back to my original amendment?

President McCarthy

No. Let me explain this so everyone understands it. The rules allow a motion to amend in order to get
the amendment right. You can make a single level of amendments to the amendment at a time. If
Alderman Deane’s motion were to pass then the motion would be to pass the amendment which is now
the goldenrod copy to replace the legislation. The motion is to amend the amendment to include the
goldenrod copy instead of the copy circulated by the Mayor.

Alderman Siegel

Just for clarity because this is getting very recursive, a yes vote would be a vote to basically vote for the
goldenrod copy, is that correct?

President McCarthy

To vote to replace the proposed amendment with the goldenrod copy.

Alderman Siegel

Okay, thank you.

A viva voce roll call was taken which resulted as follows:

Yea: Alderman Deane, Alderman Cookson, Alderman Siegel, 7
Alderman Schoneman, Alderman McGuinness, Alderman LeBrun,
Alderman Moriarty

Nay: Alderman Wilshire, Alderman Clemons, Alderman Dowd, 8
Alderman Caron, Alderwoman Melizzi-Golja, Alderman O’Brien,

Alderman Lopez, Alderman McCarthy

MOTION FAILED

Board of Aldermen Page 32
September 27, 2016

President McCarthy

The motion before us is that of amending with the copy proposed by the Mayor. Is there further
discussion on that motion?

ON THE QUESTION

Alderman Moriarty

At the risk of having someone shake their finger at me, if your motivation is to demonstrate to the world
that Nashua is a Welcoming City, all you had to do was say yes on that last amendment. If you voted no
for that then there’s something else.

Alderman Siegel

That’s probably not in our code of conduct.

Alderman Moriarty

Duly noted.

Alderman Lopez

We have gone through every possible aeration of this so | would propose to my fellow Aldermen that as
the vote is continually on the same lines and there isn’t any actual substantive objective to the
Welcoming America Initiative, there are possible 990 forms that are mysterious, there are maybe some
grant opportunities and all kinds of subjective possibilities but if we are going to vote 8 to 7 on this then
this is an opportunity to say okay, I’m not going to win the vote against; they are going to shut down
Welcoming America as a part of this so maybe | should now signal my support to the Welcoming
Community and the people gathered here today who are in support of it.

Alderman Deane

| think that’s wonderful but you just missed your opportunity to do just that.

Alderman Siegel

| couldn’t agree with my colleague, Alderman Deane more and by the way, this idea that characterizing
the snip-it’s that | put out there as not substantial, that’s a judgement call on your part. You didn’t read
this stuff, | did so you are reacting to something that | said which is a snip-it. Had you read even more
maybe you would have the same opinion, that’s fine, you are welcome to that but you are making an
awfully stiff judgement call by claiming that there was nothing substantive when in fact you are basing
that on something you yourself have not reviewed.

President McCarthy

Before we go any further | will remind the Board that remarks are intended to be addressed to the chair
on the merits of the legislation.

Alderman Siegel

| apologize, Mr. President and also to my colleague, Alderman Lopez, | did not mean to be out of line.

Board of Aldermen Page 33
September 27, 2016

Alderman Lopez

| would like to state to the chair that my assessment of it is actually a testament of my faith in Alderman
Siegel. | know he would not have spoken up unless he had thoroughly done the research.

Alderman Schoneman

| don’t see myself swaying anybody’s view but | just want to be clear that this co-ops the City of Nashua
into endorsing something that we just should not be doing. The example was given during the committee
and again here tonight that there are lots of organizations that we could be co-opted into supporting
because they support free speech, we like free speech. We should not do that. As a matter of principle |
believe that’s been inappropriate and as much as | like the goldenrod copy with the Welcoming America
Initiative in there | simply cannot vote for it in principle.

A viva voce roll call was taken which resulted as follows:

Yea: Alderman Wilshire, Alderman Clemons, Alderman Dowd, 8
Alderman Caron, Alderwoman Melizzi-Golja, Alderman O’Brien,
Alderman Lopez, Alderman McCarthy

Nay: Alderman Deane, Alderman Cookson, Alderman Siegel , 7
Alderman Schoneman, Alderman McGuinness, Alderman LeBrun,
Alderman Moriarty

MOTION CARRIED
MOTION BY ALDERMAN LOPEZ FOR FINAL PASSAGE OF R-16-068 AS AMENDED
A viva voce roll call was taken which resulted as follows:

Yea: Alderman Wilshire, Alderman Clemons, Alderman Dowd, 8
Alderman Caron, Alderwoman Melizzi-Golja, Alderman O’Brien,
Alderman Lopez, Alderman McCarthy

Nay: Alderman Deane, Alderman Cookson, Alderman Siegel , 7
Alderman Schoneman, Alderman McGuinness, Alderman LeBrun,
Alderman Moriarty

MOTION CARRIED
Resolution R-16-068 declared duly adopted as amended.
UNFINISHED BUSINESS — ORDINANCES

O-16-011
Endorsers: Alderman Don LeBrun
Alderman Ken Siegel
Alderman David Schoneman
Alderman Tom Lopez
ADOPTING PROVISIONS FOR REDUCED TAXATION FOR CERTAIN CHARTERED
PUBLIC SCHOOL FACILITIES
e Tabled at Full Board Level — 5/10/16

Board of Aldermen Page 34
September 27, 2016

O-16-016
Endorsers: Alderman David Schoneman
Alderwoman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja
Alderman Don LeBrun
AUTHORIZING STOP SIGNS AT THE INTERSECTION OF LOCK STREET AND CROSS
STREET
Given its second reading;

MOTION BY ALDERMAN SCHONEMAN FOR FINAL PASSAGE OF O-16-016
ON THE QUESTION

Alderman Moriarty

| am sure there is good reason and | respect Alderman Schoneman for being a good Ward Alderman but
| voted for one stop sign a long time ago at the persuasion of another Alderman and there are too many
stop signs up there, particularly on Lock Street, so | am going to vote no for this.

Alderman Schoneman
This is not a stop sign for traffic calming, there are sight lines that are at issue there. There are certain
requirements for putting in stop signs and in this case the city engineers went out and determined that

the sight lines are inadequate due to things that can’t be moved like utility poles and that kind of thing. It
meets the requirement based on legitimate safety concerns for this particular intersection.

Alderman Lopez

I’ve received several constituent that they were looking forward to the stop sign and they felt it was a very
good move. | am in favor of it.

Alderman Dowd

Normally | am not in favor of 4-way stops but that particular intersection is very dangerous and it came
under the recommendation of the Department of Public Works and it meets the qualifications for a 4-way
stop so | fully support Alderman Schoneman.

MOTION CARRIED

Ordinance O-16-016 declared duly adopted.

Board of Aldermen Page 35
September 27, 2016

NEW BUSINESS — RESOLUTIONS

R-16-069
Endorsers: Mayor Jim Donchess
Alderman-at-Large David W. Deane
Alderman Benjamin M. Clemons
Alderman-at-Large Lori Wilshire
Alderman Richard A. Dowd
Alderman June M. Caron
Alderman Ken Siegel
Alderwoman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja
Alderman-at-Large Michael B. O’Brien, Sr.
Alderman Tom Lopez
Alderman-at-Large Brian S. McCarthy
AUTHORIZING THE CITY OF NASHUA TO ENTER INTO A TEMPORARY SKATEPARK
EASEMENT AGREEMENT FOR THE DAVID W. DEANE SKATEBOARD PARK

Given its first reading; assigned to the COMMITTEE ON INFRASTRUCTURE and the BOARD OF
PUBLIC WORKS by President McCarthy

R-16-070
Endorsers: Mayor Jim Donchess
Alderman-at-Large Lori Wilshire
Alderman Richard A. Dowd
Alderman June M. Caron
Alderwoman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja
Alderman-at-Large Michael B. O’Brien, Sr.
Alderman Tom Lopez
RELATIVE TO THE ACCEPTANCE AND APPROPRIATION OF $32,366.55 FROM THE STATE
OF NEW HAMPSHIRE INTO POLICE GRANT ACTIVITY “FY2017 SUSTAINED TRAFFIC
ENFORCEMENT PATROLS (STEP)”
Given its first reading; assigned to the HUMAN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE by President McCarthy

R-16-071
Endorser: | Mayor Jim Donchess
Alderman Benjamin M. Clemons
Alderman Richard A. Dowd
Alderman June M. Caron
Alderwoman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja
Alderman-at-Large Michael B. O’Brien, Sr.
Alderman-at-Large Brian S. McCarthy
AUTHORIZING THE CITY OF NASHUA TO EXTEND THE LEASE AGREEMENT WITH THE
NASHUA DOG OWNERS GROUP, INC. FOR THE DOG PARK AT YUDICKY FARM

Given its first reading; assigned to the COMMITTEE ON INFRASTRUCTURE and the BOARD OF
PUBLIC WORKS by President McCarthy

Board of Aldermen Page 36
September 27, 2016

R-16-072
Endorsers: Mayor Jim Donchess
Alderman-at-Large Lori Wilshire
Alderman Richard A. Dowd
Alderman June M. Caron
Alderman Ken Siegel
Alderwoman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja
Alderman Michael B. O’Brien, Sr.
Alderman Tom Lopez
Alderman-at-Large Brian S. McCarthy
RELATIVE TO THE ACCEPTANCE AND APPROPRIATION OF $249,266.77 FROM THE STATE
OF NEW HAMPSHIRE DEPARTMENT OF SAFETY INTO POLICE GRANT ACTIVITY “FY2017
OPIOID ABUSE REDUCTION INITIATIVE (OARI)”
Given its first reading; assigned to the HUMAN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE by President McCarthy

NEW BUSINESS — ORDINANCES - None

PERIOD FOR GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENT

Mr. Jim Cutter, 86 Palm Street

We have had a problem with our neighbors, the Gilbertson’s for a long time because the city building
inspectors of 1950 and 1971 lead the Gilbertson’s astray by approving building permits that did not have
actual dimensions that violated the plat ordinance. Because it is a city error, we expect the city to correct
it. See RSA 626:3, Il, Effect of Ignorance or Mistake. This statute puts the blame on the building
inspector/public servant who approved the building permit. Sincerely, Jim.

REMARKS BY THE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD OF ALDERMEN

Alderman Lopez

| just wanted to comment that | had the opportunity to sleep in a box on Friday and particularly working
with the homeless myself | was under the impression that | understood somewhat of their situation but it
really brought it home to what some of our fellow neighbors are going through when they are having
trouble finding housing. There are many reasons for homelessness, opioid abuse or a temporary break
in their family. Regardless of the cause it’s a very unfortunate situation and there is a shortage of
housing available for people to move into; public housing or otherwise. | was encouraged this morning to
actually attend the opening of the Salmon Street Elderly Housing Program. | think making sure that the
elderly in our community don’t end up spending any nights in a box is just a basic imperative that we
should be attentive to as a city. | wanted to recognize the efforts of the city’s welfare department in doing
that.

Alderman Moriarty

The non-profit organization Symphony NH has their season opening concert at Keefe Auditorium on
Sunday at 3:00 p.m.

Alderman Schoneman

| distributed a gift and a thank you note from local churches in the community that got together to
organize some volunteer efforts and they just wanted you to know that you are thanked by them.

Board of Aldermen Page 37
September 27, 2016

Alderman Siegel

I’d like to thank everyone who worked so hard for the Downtown Nashua Music Festival and also the
farmer’s dinner which was tremendous. l’d also like to congratulate the Mayor on becoming a
grandfather.

Alderman Cookson

Earlier this evening we accepted and placed a file the Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee
meeting minutes from September 19, 2016. | am glad that since we did accept it and place it on file you
had an opportunity to review those minutes prior to accepting them. During the course of the meeting
there was a dialogue that took place between Mayor Donchess and myself and it was with regard to the
Welcoming America Initiative and during the course of that conversation Mayor Donchess attempted to
attribute a comment; what | perceived to be a comment about some information that | had provided and
his response was “I mean really, they are not the enemy.” It was with regard to a link that | had provided
in the course of discussion. At that moment when | felt that some value was being attributed to my
statement, my comment, | asked for personal privilege of the chair of the committee. As we are talking
about rules this evening, whether it be a code of conduct or whether it be Mason’s or whatever the case
may be, | asked for personal privilege that evening. Chairman Clemons response to that question or that
point was that | was out of order and to please let the Mayor finish. | just wanted to share with the rest of
Board that again, | provided the information, the Mayor attributed...| made no comment of whether it was
good or bad, | just made a statement and provided a link for the committee to review. Again, the Mayor
made the comment that suggested that it was derogatory in some way and that’s just incorrect, it’s
insulting and it was disrespectful at the time. | will let you know that the Mayor did apologize to me
between meetings and | accepted that apology. However, as we look at Mason's; I'll share some
knowledge with you. This is called questions for personal privilege, this is on page 174 for those of you
who might be interested in learning. Questions of personal privilege of members must relate to
questions related to members of the body or relate to charges against their character that would in truth
incapacitate their membership they are not entitled to the floor on a question of personal privilege unless
they propose to present relates them in there representative capacity. What happens when a member
asks for personal privilege? Vhen a question of privilege is one affecting the House or any one of its
members it requires immediate action. It may be raised while a member is speaking. It is in order to
raise the question of privilege at any time. The presiding officer must decide whether it is a question of
privilege and it is not of sufficient urgency to justify interrupting the speaker. A member wishing to raise
the question of privilege should rise and address the presiding officer without waiting to be recognized
and say “I rise to a question of privilege or privilege of the House or | rise the question of personal
privilege. The presiding officer should then request the member to state the question and in no way
should the appropriate response be by the chair that you are out of order. So, what | would suggest at
this point is that | would certainly expect at the very least an apology from the chair of the committee. It’s
important that even though he might be ignorant of the procedure and the rules of Mason’s, that he was
out of order that particular evening. At the same time, and while | understand that the chair of that
committee is a sophomore on this Board, may not be familiar with all of the rules, he was previously the
chair of another committee so he should be. He should understand what is going on. Unfortunately, Mr.
President, you happened to be sitting in this Chamber that evening as well. What | find more egregious
is the fact that you didn’t take this as an opportunity to provide some guidance to the leadership that you
have put in place on this Board. We have rules in place and it’s quite clear that | was not addressed
appropriately, accurately and nobody took the effort or time to understand what the actual motion was
and what | was entitled to. While the chairman, again, may be negligent or ignorant of the rules, | know
that you are not and | would hope that you would take this as an opportunity to educate those leaders
that you put in place to represent this body. Those are my comments this evening.

Alderman LeBrun

| would like to remind everyone that on Sunday morning at 10:00 a.m. there is a memorial on Amherst
and Concord Streets at the Fallen Firefighter's Memorial.

Board of Aldermen Page 38
September 27, 2016

President McCarthy

| want to address the issue that was just raised. | don’t lightly interfere with the business of our
committee chairs when | am at their meetings. | think it’s disrespectful as long as the proceedings are
going along well and frankly, | think there are members of this Board who would call for my head on a
plate if | did it at the committee’s that they chair, all the more so when the ruling of the committee chair is
correct. The rules on personal point’s privilege are specific to one exacting circumstance and that is
where the allegation that has been made would be disqualifying from participation in the Board if it were
true. There was no such thing before the committee at that point and the chair was well aware of that.
Whether that’s why he ruled that the request was out of order at that point, | don’t know.

Alderman Cookson

A point of personal privilege, Mr. President...

President McCarthy

Alderman Cookson, | am speaking, please wait until | am done. Is there something before us right now
that would disqualify you? If not you don’t have the right to interrupt me while | am speaking. | will
recognize you again when | am done. Whether or not that is the reason that the chair chose to make
that ruling, | don’t know. It is likely that the better approach would have been to ask about the point of
privilege and not allow a speech because frankly, we should take very seriously when we interrupt other
members who are speaking. | believe that the actions of the chair were in fact, reasonably responsible
and if he chooses to apologize to you for that then he may but | don’t believe that his actions were out of
line and the business of the committee was conducted.

Alderman Cookson

When a motion or a point of personal privilege is addressed the correct response is exactly as you just
stated and that is to allow the speaker to continue to address what that point is that he/she perceives to
be the issue. The inappropriate response is to be called out of order.

Committee announcements:

ADJOURNMENT

MOTION BY ALDERMAN DEANE THAT THE SEPTEMBER 27, 2016, MEETING OF THE BOARD OF
ALDERMEN BE ADJOURNED

MOTION CARRIED

The meeting was declared adjourned at 10:30 p.m.

Attest: Patricia D. Piecuch, City Clerk